What can we say? The
Tilt, like the Kaiser upon which it's based, is the ultimate execution of Windows Mobile 6 in this form factor. It's not for everyone, of course; Windows Mobile is the same old, cranky curmudgeon here that is is everywhere else -- and as anyone who's used version 6 knows, it's nothing more than 5 in a fresh set of clothes. That being said, HTC has done a great job of sprucing up the joint with a sprinkling of add-ins that make the OS more usable, while AT&T brings goodies like TeleNav, AT&T Music, and Cellular Video to the table. The hardware, though, is where this sucker shines. The Tilt has singlehandedly renewed our faith in HTC's ability to make exquisitely engineered devices, feeling utterly rock solid despite its relatively complex slide-tilt mechanism. It's heavy, but comfortably (and reassuringly) so, not to the point of annoyance, and the dark color scheme with black chrome nav keys looks better than we'd expected. One beef we expect some folks will have is with the Tilt's pudge -- it ain't the thinnest device in the world, about the same as the N95 (see the comparo shots in the gallery) -- but if you can get past that, this thing is
the Windows Mobile device to have. For the moment, anyhow!
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Ted @ Oct 4th 2007 3:19PM
Thanks for posting the photo's. I'm definitely interested in getting one.
Can anyone confirm that it accepts a standard headset plug? I continue to hate not having that on my 3125.
Lastly, what are people's thoughts about this as compared to the Motorola Q9h? Is AT&T expected to offer that as well? When?
Martin @ Oct 4th 2007 3:35AM
Does it come in iPhone?
Neg2LED @ Oct 4th 2007 4:03AM
NEVER!
Martin @ Oct 4th 2007 4:05AM
Why would that be bad? The Tilt + iPhone = Perfect phone
webon @ Oct 4th 2007 6:08AM
ah (fanboi)choo!
Martin @ Oct 4th 2007 6:14AM
Anyone who doesn't think that the an iPhone with the specs of the Tilt would be the best phone ever is either lying or just an anti-Apple fanboy.
Spoon!! @ Oct 4th 2007 1:08PM
@Martin
The iPhone with all the specs of the Tilt (including slide-out keyboard) WOULD be an awesome phone... except for the made by Apple part. They'd likely cripple the thing and not allow any 3rd party software installations.
Jess Maron @ Oct 4th 2007 3:37AM
I can never find specs on the GPS chip used in smartphones; does this thing run off a SurfstarIII (20 sat.)?
Neg2LED @ Oct 4th 2007 4:02AM
they're SirfSTAR III yes. Almost all GPS chips today are SS3
NuShrike @ Oct 4th 2007 4:50AM
Nope, it's Qualcomm's GPSone A-GPS. Check out the MSM7200 specs by Google. From using it, it's pretty good, fast fixes, and locks on to a few satellites still even in a concrete parking garage, or inside my home.
Sean Donnellan @ Oct 4th 2007 5:48AM
pdadb.net is an excellent place for the nitty gritty chip specs for these types of phones. (Switch to "Detailed view")
You can see all three Kaiser varieties (100, 110, 120 - No Camera, 1&2 Cameras) as well as all the re-badegd names - Tilt (AT&T), v1615 (Vodafgone), VPA Compact V (Vodafone again ?!), MDA VarioIII (T-Mobile) and TyTNII (HTC).
As mentioned the GPS chip is the "Qualcomm MSM7200 gpsOne", 20 Channels, NMEA 0183 protocol.
Jimmy Sieben @ Oct 4th 2007 4:12AM
How is the battery life?
ShortFuse @ Oct 4th 2007 9:53AM
4.4 hour 3G talktime, 7 hour GSM talktime
Dave @ Oct 4th 2007 7:42AM
who the hell gives a shit about the hands on? we got that in howardforums like a week ago...the real question is when is it coming out? Stop torturing me AT&T!!!
I.P. Freely @ Oct 4th 2007 8:58AM
Tomorrow... http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pid=4800&cdvn=news&newsarticleid=24486
Joel Varty @ Oct 4th 2007 9:11AM
This UI looks totally lacking when you see the HTC branded version of this phone. No TouchFlo, no tabbed-Today plugin.... what gives? I would love to see the "Tilt" with all the htc branded goodies added on...
Unless there was a reason AT&T left those out? Do they slow the thing down? What about the reports that this phone is REALLY slow for media playback in WM10?
Bobby @ Oct 4th 2007 9:43AM
You can always wait a few days for someone on XDA-Developers to dump the TyTN II rom. It would get rid of all the AT&T bloatware too.
aw @ Oct 4th 2007 9:40AM
Damn, just bought an 8525 2 weeks ago. Oh well. At least maybe now they'll finally ship their WM6 upgrade to their older phones. Rumor was they were waiting for something like this before they did it.
Terrence Meekins @ Oct 4th 2007 10:48AM
RETURN THE 8525!!!!
This has a 3 megapixel cam, plus u get WM6, and doesn't it have more memory? I would say this is definitely an upgrade to the 8525 and at $299 its a great price. The 8525 wasn't that low when it first came out was it?
aw @ Oct 4th 2007 11:32AM
The 8525 currently is not that low. It depends on the specs in the new guy, but I may have to go return it this weekend. The 8525 is $450 with $100 in rebates to make it 350. I feel kinda cheated.
Guess I'm making a trip back to the store this weekend
Evilecho @ Oct 4th 2007 9:52AM
can we get a screen shot of the rom info
Ed @ Oct 4th 2007 10:14AM
Would you all say it's an incremental update over the 8525, or is it way better? What are the processor and memory specs? I just ordered the 8525 for $199 plus a $50 cell phone credit... Thanks!
Tim @ Nov 11th 2007 1:19PM
This thing is hands down "way better"
Check pdadb.net "pdacomparer" for a good comparison: http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=861&id2=588
Ignore the secondary camera in the comparison of course.
Thickness .2" thinner, 128 MB RAM, 256MB ROM, GPS, Camera, Flip up screen...
I think the ram will show the most difference, can't figure out why so few Windows Mobile devices don't supply more than 64 MB yet, seems to be one of the biggest problems for me.
adam @ Oct 4th 2007 11:52AM
you do not need a data plan for this nor do you need to use the telenav service. if you own another windows mobile gps app, feel free to install it and run it. this has been covered before on modaco.
also, paul, the sites owner has said that given the choice between the HTC rom and the AT&T rom, he would choose the AT&T rom but could not give specifics as at the time of posting, this was a huge leak from an informant. He said use the AT&T rom and tweak it how you want. most of the pre-installed apps are not in the ROM itself and can be uninstalled after the first run where you get the intro screen and then customization.
adam @ Oct 4th 2007 1:50PM
also, for those who skipped a generation like me but are interested in the tilt, here is a size comparison i did.
http://sizeasy.com/page/size_comparison/5962-Cingular-8125-vs-AT-T-Tilt-vs-AT-T-Sync
3 devices:
tilt
samsung sync (my current phone, free via premier ;) )
cingular 8125 aka htc wizard
frank @ Oct 4th 2007 2:27PM
Speaking of the ROM...
I have the Sprint 6700 (or "The Brick" as I like to call it) through work. I upgraded it to WM6 using a hacked firmware that I believe was mentioned here not long ago. To my surprise, the Today screen was replaced by the way cooler looking and way more useful one pictured here:
http://pocketpccentral.net/images/htc_touch_x195.jpg
Does anybody know where that came from? I had the Wing for a little while, an official WM6 device, but it sure as hell didn't have that interface. I don't know if it's part of the whole TouchFlo thing or what but it's the ONLY way to do WinMo if you ask me.
magnus @ Oct 4th 2007 2:30PM
I am a happy European user of a TYN II. This machine feels and runs much smoother than the TYN I I used for the last twelve months on either side of the pond.
Important: The TYN II allows you to disable the HSPDA if not needed, because if the data transfer is on and you try to call, you cannot get a connect! So remember to disable HSPDA if you want to be able to dial out all the time. Turn it on only if you use the handset as a modem. I do so in either the UK, Germany, Switzerland and the US (AT&T) and it works like a charm.
Still lacking:
- WM6 nor HTC TouchFlow has profiles with the possibility to transfer your calls to another number. For this feature, visit pocketmax.net for their phone alarm soft (note: I am not affiliated with them or get any rewards for mentioning them here).
- Battery life: Use it all day as I do (more than a hundred emails a day, more than three hours talk time) and you need at least 1.5 batteries/day. You buy this phone, be prepared to buy both a second battery and a second charger!
If you are a heavy user: This is the phone to use!
ShaneD @ Oct 4th 2007 3:03PM
I was sold on this phone when I first heard about it, but the more I see it, the less interested I am.
It has the most features hands down. That's not the issue. But I am becoming less and less interested in WM Professional. Even though it has way more features, I hate pulling out the stylus everytime I want to do something. I just want to tap it with my finger. But WM makes all the taps so small that you almost have to use a stylus. If WM Standard (non-touch screen) was a little more feature rich, I would go that route.
The other thing that bothers me is why did HTC choose the weak 240x320 screen? With the importance of internet and email use being touted so much with recent high end phones, higher resolution screens have become standard to make the experience more user friendly. QVGA screens flat out suck when surfing webpages. Not enough fits on screen and you have to scroll back and forth and up and down. Again, not easy with your finger, so you have to use the Dpad or the stylus. Yuck.
You can make the font way smaller to fit more on, but that makes it harder to read too. Plus pocket IE is pretty weak in general.
The phone app is another gripe of mine. On full QWERTY sliders like this you either have to slide the keyboard out and dial in widescreen mode (not easy one handed in a car) or you have to use the onscreen dialer with it's small buttons, which usually means having to use my second hand again with a stylus. That's why I usually like designs that have a actual dial pad, or huge onscreen buttons to dial with one hand and you finger easily.
It is also pretty fat. Understandable given all the stuff they packed in there, but not sure I want to carry around a phone that big everyday when I was used to the Blackjack before.
I really want this phone. It is almost what I'm looking for, but I really want a better screen, dialer, and smaller form factor. I'm hoping I can wait another 6 months for a better rendition. Maybe the Omni will address these issues. However, even so, WM Pro needs a big re-write to make the UI easier to use one handed. (ie, better dpad or finger navigation)
This is the one area I really like what Apple did on the iphone. They left out dozens of basics unfortunately, which is why I would never buy it yet. But what they did include they did right. High res screen, great internet experience, easy nav with one hand and your finger only, slim small form factor.
If these two devices could learn from each other, we would really have something. All the features in an easy to use interface and clean design.
Why does it take so long for someone to put it all together? Every company keeps saying this is the perfect device, but they proceed to leave out something basic that is already available on other devices! God help me.
Ypoknons @ Oct 4th 2007 6:23PM
There's several diallers for Windows Mobile. None of them work for you?
Juwelz @ Oct 4th 2007 3:11PM
whats the differ btw HTC Tilt and HTC Tytn II that is on HTC.com. ANd when is the HTC Tytn II being released
adam @ Oct 4th 2007 4:10PM
the AT&T Tilt is their version of the tytn II.
htc wizard = cingular 8125
htc tytn = cingular 8525
htc tytn II = AT&T Tilt (8925)
Juwelz @ Oct 4th 2007 5:49PM
What happen to the software, wasn't it supposed to come with touch flow software and the front camera... and where online can i get htc tytn II like the one on the video. Youtube link below!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyk0TR6pUPA
Charles W. @ Oct 4th 2007 7:03PM
Do you need to have a data plan to use to GPS? Does anyone know what GPS comes with the TyTn II? I know this has TeleNav.
adam @ Oct 4th 2007 11:31PM
the gps chip in here is a qualcomm chipset called gpsOne. it does not require the use of telenav but that is what at&t wants you to use. if you want to use tomtom, igo, google maps, live search, etc. feel free as the hardware is not tied to the telenav service
Chem E Sam @ Oct 5th 2007 12:49AM
i got mine a few hours ago it is very nice!! much better then my 6700.
John @ Oct 5th 2007 4:44PM
Guys stay away form AT&T and Telenav and their deceptive practices.
Let me first say for "legal reasons" below is simply my opinion/impression you make your own call on whats going on but my mind is made up.
Telenav the AT&T preferred partner for GPS is apparently deceiving users into believing that they currently dont have a way to run their latest version on the AT&T 8525. There are loads of users complaining because their purchased the phones thinking they had the advanced features advertised by AT&T such as 3D maps and traffic information only to find out later AT&T was not telling the truth. Although their other versions included this functionality the version allowed on the AT&T 8525 was quite old without these features. All the while we were locked into a contract we cant get out of on top of buying a phone we cant take back. It recently came to my attention there was a download available marked for a different phone with the same hardware which worked. I downloaded it and installed and as I was told no problems at all. Works fine, tested all over no issues. I informed Telenav and was promptly warned not to mention this. As well now my original post has been deleted, even though they originally responded several times (I have the screenshots). They must have had some internal meeting on how to handle this "leak" and they decided to censor me. As well they have now deleted all related posts in their forum. Well, actually not deleted the post entirely, just removed any text in my post so it is now blank. My suspicion which they chose to dance around was there is a specific reason they are not providing the update and thats business decision between Telenav and AT&T. You see AT&T is releasing today the 8925, they upgraded version of the 8525. And while the hardware is virtually identical, it comes withe latest version of Telenav. It is my position that Telenav is purposly not releasing an update to the software which their customers were duped into purchased based on false advertisement because AT&T wants to force you to buy the new phone to get it. Very Sleezy in my opinion. i want to mare sure it is known that this type of practice will not be accepted my the mobile community and we will look to more respectable vendors for applications.
Edward @ Oct 6th 2007 7:35AM
John, before we let ignorance cloud our judgement, understand this.
I do not work for AT&T or own stock in it, nor do I feel compelled to provide you with answers. But I do feel compelled to provide knowledge to those who do not understand how technology works.
The 8525 does NOT have a GPS receiver. The 8925 DOES. For Telenav OR any other GPS Tracking software to work, you need a 'GPS RECEIVER'. That being said, and crystal clear, I had never previously heard or seen any mention of the AT&T/Cingular 8525 having a GPS receiver, of ANY sort. For use of the 8525 with GPS location tracking, you would need to pair an 8525 with a BLUETOOTH GPS device. This is the only way I know of for tracking locations with a non-gps device.
NOW: if on some off chance you mistook some salesman by saying it's 'GPS Capable' as it does GPS locating, they were misleading. This device is CAPABLE with a GPS receiver attached (wired or wirelessly). Though I do not know of any wired GPS solutions for mobile phones (cause I don't research wired attachment for wireless devices, sounds dumb to me.)
However: On the offchance you were 'duped' into believing that the phone had a GPS receiver built in, then either the salesman used an, admittedly dishonest and wrong tactic, or he himself had no clue what he was talking about, and was just trying to sell you a device. So at the end of the day, you should have returned it, due to miscommunication, or misleading information.
But just to clarify, THE CINGULAR/AT&T 8525 does NOT have a GPS RECEIVER. Hence cannot natively support GPS locating.
saq @ Oct 6th 2007 12:23AM
I just picked mine up and flash the HTC ROM on it, yay TomTom!
This thing is a huge improvement over my 8525 which was admittedly a fantastic device. Its going to be a while until I'm used to the new way it slides out (opposite of previous models) but I can see some of the advantages.
Armando @ Oct 8th 2007 8:56AM
Saq,
Can you tell us how did you flash your ROM? If so can you send link with instructions? If not send specific link where to find them...thanks
John @ Oct 6th 2007 12:11PM
Edward,
What in the world does having an internal GPS have to do with this? As part of the sale, and once again in addition to the sale of the phone I opted to buy the bluetooth GPS receiver from Telenav which was required. However that was not my complaint. Please read more carefully. My complaint was about specifically functionality in the Telenav. Functionality that was advertised as working on my phone was in fact not suppored. Not because of any hardware limitation, but purely software. They told me I would have an upgrade soon and it never appeared after a year. All the while they were releasing upgrades for other phones, and now even support the tilt with the version. My complaint is that they have had a working version (albeit for another model) that works fine (I am using it now which is why they are mad at me) on the 8525 for quite some time and never told us. And when I mentioned to users if they needed this functionality they could run this version but of course it would be unsupported, Telenav got heated and started deleting all my posts, in fact entire threads. The point is they are purposely choosing not to upgrade the version so i am forced to buy a newer phone for the functionality. Please Edward, explain oh wise one??
Armando @ Oct 8th 2007 8:56AM
Saq,
How did you flsh your ROM, do you have instructions?? If not, can you send SPECIFIC link? We will appreciate it...thanks
Bob @ Oct 10th 2007 11:56PM
Is the att smaller or bigger than the 8525?
virgoRV @ Oct 11th 2007 3:15PM
Guys
I just got my tilt today and looks good. Audio clarity is awesome. A bit bulky to carry in the pocket. No headphone jack.!!!
I signed up for the 39.99 unlimited data plan.
The phone shows Media.NET connection in the connection settings with GPRS,3G connection configured with wap.cingular.com acces point. Is this the regular data connection? Does it get covered in the unlimited data plan? or am I supposed to use another connection? Please let me know.
Also I heard that we can download maps to the system and then sync to the tilt throgh active sync. Is it? or do I need to download the maps directly to my tilt through data connection?
I appreciate any help
jrin @ Oct 15th 2007 10:12PM
I don't know -- I don't think it's THAT much of an improvement over the 8525. That being said, the built in GPS is the one thing that I see as being worth buying it, over the 8525. For those of us still in contract (like me, haha), the price of buying the Tilt vs the 8525 just isn't worth it (imho). Plus, the keyboard on the 8525 is much easier/better to use than on the Tilt -- the tilt uses rubber keys, vs plastic on the 8525. I found I had to press directly in the middle (or real close) of the keys on the tilt, and press somewhat hard too. Whereas on the 8525, they're plastic, so pressing on the edge (or not right in the middle) make the whole key depress, plus they are easier to press (less force required). Now, this really only matters substantially when trying to type fast, but isn't that what everyone "does"? type fast?
I also compared the build in GPS with the iBlue-737 bluetooth gps unit I use on my 8525 and found it's JUST as good, which was a very pleasant surprise! The camera isn't nearly as good at the 8525, even being 3.0, so that was disappointing.
(not to plug my own review, haha, you can see sample pics, and the gps data, on my review at http://www.jrin.net/2007_10_14/review-att-tilt-htc-att-8925/ )
Andrew @ Oct 19th 2007 12:44AM
I really want to get this phone but I am not so sure about the using the stylus part. I would much rather use my fingers. Especially when dialing a number on the touch screen. Is it just horribly bad to use when your using your finger instead of the stylus. Please tell me what you think
Nick @ Oct 21st 2007 4:46AM
First day with the Tilt and here are some opinions:
So far it seems like it's pretty solid. I'm Mac guy and I compared the iPhone and the Tilt--even though it's a WM6 device. Part of the reason that I went this route is that the iPhone is too tied up in trying to be all things to all people: Is it for entertainment or is it a productivity device? It does an okay job of either but doesn't really excel at any. In the end, an 8MB iPod that happens to have a phone attached didn't seem very appealing or useful (I have way too much music to have to pick-and-choose what does/not go on to the device). The current inability to install 3rd party software kinda blows, too. Also, it is NOT 3G compatible--sorry guys, the Tilt is more accessible and will smoke your iPhone. If you are in need of the entertainment, the Tilt has a flash memory slot; apparently you can get a 3 gig card to put your MP3's/WMA's/AAC's on. Since a lot of my music is tied up in iTunes and trapped in Mac-dom, I'll just get a real iPod, put all of my media on it, and leave each device to do its thing. Ever since my 3rd generation iPod, I never really "got" putting my contacts/calendars/notes on it anyway...
For those of you (like me) that are more in-need of the productivity, the Tilt was seemingly built for it... email, documents, etc. The tilt keyboard is a little difficult to get used to but so far it seems easier to use than the multi-key qwerty thing that the smaller Blackberries are churning out (e.g. Pearl, etc.). And, I believe having the option of using a keyboard (with the feedback from the buttons) is useful--something Apple will probably not put onto an iPhone, ever. Yes, the screen is smaller than that of the iPhone and when you're using the stylus for the PDA, you'll want to make sure that you're not moving (e.g., driving). If you need a bigger screen, get a laptop. Also, when using the stylus gets old, open/flip it and the keys you need to operate ~85-90% of it are offered. The camera functions are just "blah"; probably on par with the iPhone. Again, this is a feature for which I have little-to-no use. Honestly, the video sucks; not enough frames per second so your videos look like a bad trip on some heavy duty pharmaceuticals.
In respect to the essential function of the device (the phone), the on screen dialing isn't bad--the keys are about the size of a RAZR or SLVR, and as you get more familiar with the device, you'd probably be able to use the phone portion while driving. Texting and driving won't happen, as far as I've been able to tell. If you plan on Tilting and driving you'd be better off not setting a password on the device--or at least get in the habit of disabling it before you drive; if it's locked you can't get to the phone; kinda inconvenient. It's a cell phone so your coverage and reception will vary dependent upon way too many variables... Overall, I haven't had a problem with it. Mom's voice sounds as real-to-life as any other cell phone that I've ever used.
The biggest drawback that I can find is that it doesn't natively sync with my Macintosh--and that's not necessarily the device's fault. I had hoped that I'd be able to sync the two via Bluetooth but iSync doesn't support WM6 natively--go figure, right? If anybody finds a way to do this via Bluetooth without having to buy 3rd party software, PLEASE let me know. There's apparently software out there that will allow you to sync WM6 to your iCal, Address Book, iPhoto, etc., but I haven't had a chance to test any of them out. The Tilt is so new that I haven't seen one that specifically claims to support a Mac/Tilt sync but I'd assume they would.
There was a comment earlier wishing that the Tilt ran the iPhone OS. A merging of the two would be a beautiful thing: Tilt's features w/ the blissfully ease of use that the iPhone offers. WM6's settings can be maddeningly difficult to tweak (especially for a Mac guy), but once you have them set the Tilt is easy-enough to use. I'll give it a week before I deface it with one of my left over Apple stickers.
Oh, and the XM Radio option is potentially very cool, though it's through your data plan--definitely a reason to consider the unlimited data plans. It's a watered-down channel lineup but it has the more-popular stations. Telenav and the GPS receiver seems cool, too... just started my 30 day trial and I haven't had much opportunity to use it. As I recall there's no GPS on the iPhone?